Are Politicians Putting Warfighters Lives At Risk? OPSEC Says Yes

G'Morning 6, left that part out :-P

@Recon6 @M4GRUNT @Matt2 Hellz yeah, it's how we roll!

 @HugeFan  @Recon6  @M4GRUNT  @Matt2    Good Morning HF!!  You protect the West Coast, I got the East, I think Spoonts is here also, M2 and AW are relatively close to you.  We got it All covered bro...6

Rec@Recon6 @M4GRUNT @Matt2 Recv'd, thanks for the bit of perspective. I'll work on not dwelling so much on the little shit. :-) HF

 @HugeFan  @Recon6  @M4GRUNT  @Matt2   HF, Also, the Only instances where trigger time is important is during a discussion on matters of warfare, otherwise, not so much.  I know you appreciate Service, thus your name, but remember We value your input just as much.    6

 @HugeFan  @Recon6  @M4GRUNT  @Matt2   HF, Good Morning my West Coast Brother!!  I Rec'd all you said, many times over!  BW never intended for His site to be a bunch of Lemmings.  Free thought and speech on a given topic done with (normally!) consideration of the rights of others.  It appears the attraction of Newbies like SF Vet and Coriolanus and a couple of others has upped the ante on certain subject matter,  to the betterment of us all.  Guess we should have expected one or two of lesser acceptance to also tag along.

That being said, perhaps now we can get back to more discussion of relevant topics with civility.    R6

@Recon6 @M4GRUNT @Matt2 You're right as usual, 6. I don't like seeing the "blue on blue" as it were because we are all here for the same reason. Discuss what's right and what's wrong, problem solve, show our unity and support for our armed forces. Young bucks should know better than to sound off against their seniors like that. With a call sign like RVN SF VET, I'm going to imagine that he knows exactly what he's talking about and while that doesn't mean us guys have to agree with it( which I did agree with RVN SF VET) we do have to afford the courtesy of disagreeing respectfully. Just like when, on the rare occasion I disagree with you. You and the other vets here should always have the last word. Grunt obviously should have a bit more leeway than I as it is assumed by his posts that he has served but, again running people off because they don't drink your brand of Kool-Aid isn't what this place is about. HF oh and "G'Morning 6"!

 @M4GRUNT  @Matt2   M4, come on man, IF you are truly a Grunt there is No Way you would sound off like this.  There are several of us Combat Grunts on this site and until now it has been respectful of Everyone,  Either you had a mental lapse, understandable, or you are some high school kid running his mouth on a Military site.  I will think the former until I hear otherwise.  Come on bro...R6

 @HugeFan  @Matt2  @M4GRUNT   HF, LOL, brother you took it straight up a long time ago and shook it off like a real grunt, everyone just throw a few "FU's, kiss my ass' " etc and Charley Mike!!  This is SOFREP, Not SOFTREP!!  SF Vet will be back and dialogue will continue per usual.    R6

@Matt2 @M4GRUNT Evidently, M4Grunt has taken it upon himself to demonstrate Brandon's 99/1 Rule for us. I hope that RVN SF VET was literally just feeling tired, got some rest and will come back because that dude was solid and a "real deal" kind of cat. M4Grunt direct that bile towards the enemy, not us. Sounds like you need to someone about your anger, Coriolanus's link should help you find much needed perspective. Don't talk crazy, shit don't phase me.

 @M4GRUNT  

You give all grunts a bad rap DB

 @Matt2 Thanks. However, I am getting tired. I feel like I'm having to repeat myself. Of course, the Livefyre format doesn't help.

 @RVN SF VET Got it Sir!

 @JuliaHugoRachel The video. I try to avoid direct comments at people, rather at the content of there comments.

 @RVN SF VET  @CalebMuibu Ok Sir, I'm at least glad my hunch was correct.

 @CalebMuibu Roger that. He confirmed in a separate message.

 @RVN SF VET I think he means "Lamestream Media" if I'm not mistaken.

@Matt2 I understand.

 @Matt2  @M4GRUNT

 It was a respectable educating thread, Cholo rolls in in, in that East Village Lord Humoungous way and starts insulting people he should be learning from.

@Matt2 @M4GRUNT http://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/000/348/retarded.jpg

 @M4GRUNT I don't know what LSM means. Google didn't help and suggested Linux Security Modules.

 @RVN SF VET Sorry not attempting to debate anything with you. It would be a huge waste of time. It took me reading a few of your posts here to see how you rely on the LSM. good luck with that. Maybe 1 day you will evolve.

 @RVN SF VET  @rozhbash  @Matt2 Perhaps you are correct, " The video will have no impact on Washington leaks" However, perhaps legal challenges will aid this video to have an affect in preventing leaks in the future. WE know what happened to Kennedy and Johnson and Nixon. Knowing that, Leaks such as this can be monumental as far as public opinion and national security as blowback. Sir, I keep asking the question which I feel is a good one to ask and I would like your opinion. The men that produced and spoke in this video (no matter what their polilitical affiliation) - A) did not endorse Romneys' camp  B) Expected to have their reputations torn apart and a public backlash thrown at them (anyone that has been through public backlash,  it is rough) and C)Hostorically,  Romney has les than a 33% chance of beating an incumbent .

So why make this Video knowing all of the above facts?  With classified reports on collateral damage being sealed for decades about the potential blowback of these leaks, why not keep their mouths zipped? Perhaps more DEVGRU, SEAL, CAG and Intelligence operators support this video and the folks in it were the mouthpiece. Perhaps this was just a request "to stop the leaks". Just a theory. But I'd like to hear you opinion. Thank You.

 @ArcticWarrior  @JuliaHugoRachel1  @RVN SF VET  @rozhbash  @Matt2 I think it is on everyones mind. I am sorry to have thrown it out there. My son mentioned that fact in this discussion. I hate to even look that direction. Makes me sick. Bad guys may not have gotten lucky on 8/6. I dropped to my knees and puked that day. Intelligence reports 8-10 weeks prior to that showed risk. They did not get to where they needed to get.

 @RVN SF VET I respect you and your knowledge and factual accounting. However, the investigation will be ongoing  at a top secret level. The leaks of most concern are within our military and the chance of that particular helo getting hit with those particular men is very coincidental. There will be a top classified investigation ongoing in this matter. That was where my remark was coming from. Enough said, whatever the situation, it will be hanmdled. In the end, whatever that report many say, it may have been blowback from the leak out of our government. That remains to be seen. I was pointing out the tentacles of the leak. That one has not been ruled out as of yet. The reports you speak of are public knowledge. Behind those reports, per normal protocol, many times, are classified investigations and reports.

 @JuliaHugoRachel1  @RVN SF VET  @JuliaHugoRachel  @rozhbash  @Matt2

 Ouch JHR I was waiting for someone to throw that JFK thing out in the ring, but I think sometimes the bad guy just gets lucky, same with 8/6/11 sometimes the squirters have seen you go to the well one too many times, they can do SALUTE reports as well, and RPG7s and 'Nooks trying to get under power dont mix.

 @JuliaHugoRachel1  @RVN SF VET

 If nobody was publically punished for Sept 11th I would think nobody has been punished for anything since, maybe Scooter but that was for being less then honest to a Federal Agent..

 @JuliaHugoRachel1 The investigation says it was just an ambush by clever Taliban/foreign fighters. IMHO, it was facilitated by a bad tactical plan. The investigation says that I'm wrong. Helicopters are not invulnerable - they've got to remember that. Leaks in the Afghan environment were the least of our worries as long as we kept the target from the Afghans. Now that we are giving them more control, we will have no control of OPSEC. The death of the 3 Marines in the gym is an example of the OPSEC SOP being ignored.

 @RVN SF VET  @JuliaHugoRachel  @rozhbash  @Matt2

 And what happened to Kennedy? Think about that.

 @RVN SF VET I have a hard time getting back to posts as well! You are not the only one! The condesending statement was about "what coast do you live on" and a few other comments you've made like "you should stay out of the imtelligence field", or something to that affect. All is forgotten. People stick up for themselves and move on. Tough skins. Ny point, you may be talking to someone in Intelligence, law, politics, COIN, SF, etc. You never know on here....

On your question to me. I amreferring to the leaks in the Video, and all leaks known of since Commander in Chief has been in office. There are probably other leaks that are not public information. I am not in the Leak business, but I take note when so many have occurred in the past 4 years.

On the Nixon Leaks, men took the fall for those. They spent time in prison in order "to take one for the team". i.e. Frank Sturgis. May I ask, who takes one for the team with the DEVGRU leaks? The team or their families? Was the 8/6/11 heo crash (ambush?) connected  with the leaks? We don't know how far this leak ripples.

 @M4GRUNTPolitical connections.

 @M4GRUNT They be the leakers faves.

 @RVN SF VET I have seen morons assigned to positions that had no training or aptitude. Nothing new. We had G2 enlisted members that I would match up against any of these so called Intel Analyst or Counter Intel  people I see on any station today. My favorite saying is, Your academic pedigree does not outweigh the strength of my argument. Washington Compost and New York Slimes? Best to get source intel from other resources.

 @M4GRUNT  You think that he lacks credentials? You ought to see who Bush and Obama have placed on the National Security Council staff as experts on everything from counter-terrorism to COIN. You will find political hacks and academics with no working experience who, nonetheless have written papers and books on these subjects!

 @JuliaHugoRachel  @Matt2  This is getting to be hysterical.

"The video, produced by a group called the Special Operations OPSEC Education Fund, features interviews with former military and intelligence personnel who say Obama “had nothing to do” with the successful May 2011 raid on bin Laden’s compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan. The video also accuses Obama’s administration with leaking classified information to the press for political gain."

OK, which is it? Is he the Commander in Chief or not? Good heavens, if the mission had failed, whose fault would that have been? Why, let's ask Mitt Romney, he's an authority on Executive powers and the chain-of-command isn't he? He's also an authority on OPSEC as Massachusetts secrets have never leaked!

How stupid can the propagandists be? Our military crossed an international border 3 times and killed an enemy of the US without permission of the country they entered. Well, let's see, who has that authority? Could it be Admiral McRaven, or the CENTCOM commander or the Secretary of Defense? Could it be the Director of the CIA - why heck yes he can do whatever he wants! Who decides if the helicopters with the QRF can clandestinely land uninvited in another country in support of the raid? Well, just about anybody I guess. Who can authorize the CIA to take command of a military joint activity and direct their operation cutting out the JCS, CENTCOM, ISAF, AND SOCOM? Well hell, Secretary Gates and Director Panetta had dinner together and shook on it without bothering the socialist, commie President. No sweat.

Frankly, there are tons of citizens who will swallow this crap because they are ignorant. If you think I'm being unkind, just watch Jay Leno when he goes out on the street and asks passersby simple questions about our government or current events. They don't know jack or even Bob.

I doubt that the President made the one or two tactical decisions that were attributed to him, but it's certainly possible because those decisions could have been informed by a desire to guarantee the return of the raiders as opposed to some military understanding of the problem. But, there is only one person who can authorize what was done - the President. Technically, what we did could be construed as an act of war.The likelihood that UBL was there was around 50/50 or less.So he had to decide whether it was worth the risk to the men, the country, and to his Presidency (see Jimmy Carter) to go ahead with an even chance that the bastard was there?

But according to these public spirited highly qualified SOF experts, he had nothing to do with it! How did those noble, brave, objective, patriotic citizens come to their conclusion? Easy - they are Republican politicians unafraid to lie to achieve political gain in the run down to the election. Shazaam! They are liars because most of them do know how these decisions are made and they do understand the chain of command. So, they are informed liars.There is no other explanation when you assert that the President has "nothing to do" with the raid or the success of the raid.

What is true is that there are people who having been tirelessly hunting UBL for 10 years since TORA BORA. That is something the President did not set up, but he did keep the emphasis on finding him. I doubt that anyone opposed funding their operation. President Obama invited President Bush to come to Washington and share the podium to announce that we got UBL. President Bush declined and has made a point of staying out of the spotlight for the last 4 years. That is what he prefers.  But the impetus for the hunt began wirth President Bush whom we referred to as "the decider."

Well, guess who the decider is now?

 @Matt2 "They support the video", thats good. I liked that what they said more, about presenting a "posture" for the Nation, that was good. That shows integrity and moral.

 @Matt2  @HugeFan here is a tidbit (just a tidbit) in an article on Romneys Stance. http://www.boston.com/politicalintelligence/2012/08/19/mitt-romney-campaign-says-outside-group-video-attacking-president-obama-makes-important-point-about-credit-for-osama-bin-laden-raid/s8S3mUJ2OlDR2GbqO28rhM/story.html