The founding fathers of America were slave owners, therefore we must do away with the American flag…or so the bizarre rationale will go. Throughout American history we have fought long and hard for the civil rights of various groups of people. What is important to remember is that the founding fathers created a constitutional framework for change in the government, one which civil rights leaders were able to stand upon and fight for black rights, gay rights, and other issues. Let’s not throw out the baby with the bath water in a misguided attempt to erase our own history.
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blkyank YankeePapa MarkM32 , . "...The north already had it's "Pickett's Charge" at Fredericksburg..." . ...Indeed. Even though the Union forces at the wall were compassionate to the wounded who came into their hands... there was a brief moment when the Union forces cried across the field "Fredericksburg!, Fredericksburg...!" . ....As I indicated earlier, the best chance for some sort of a major local victory (facing McClellan) ruined in late 1862 at Antietam. But while it might have generated the political result... it would not have knocked the Union out of the war militarily. . ... At Gettysburg, by withdrawing towards Washington (not actually attempting to take it) they could have forced the Union Army to attack on unfavorable ground under massive pressure from Washington. . ...The Union Army did not have to be destroyed... (though a collapse at Little Round Top on the second day might have allowed another Chancellorsville... one with more daylight... It was a close run thing... far more so than the charge the next day...) just savaged to where the Confederates could muck about for a time and then meander back across the Potomac at their leisure. The political impact far more significant than the military. . ...Historian Shelby Foote said that given such a defeat... the Union could have raised and deployed more armies (like the Soviets in 1942-43)... *if* it had the will. The question certainly was not Lincoln's will... but that of the people, the politicians, and (in many cases) his Cabinet. . ...Conquering the entire North was of course impossible. Even if Washington captured the war would go on... "if" the will was there. We will never know. . ...As you mentioned, the massive bloodletting in the Spring and Summer of 1864 knocked much of the Northern public on the ropes... psychologically... The Union was not Russia or France... such casualties... (not spread out with quiet periods in between) racked up almost without pause, caused many in the North to wonder if it was worth it... ("Let 'em go...") . ...Lee understood that to some extent it was a matter of nerve. Since Grant wasn't attacking... then going into camp for a number of months and then timidly returning to the battlefield... but rather hammering non-stop... win or lose... even with a favorable loss ratio the South would run out of enough men to cover the front before the North did. . ...Lee told his officers that he had to try to keep Grant from maneuvering him into a siege... Because if it came down to a siege, it would just be a matter of time. Grant kept being thwarted... until he at last got to Petersburg where it settled into a siege that in some ways was a precursor of the Western Front in WWI. . ...It came down to the will of the people of the North. Tragically, one way that this manifested itself was after the hideous two charges at Cold Harbor... Grant's biggest blunder. . ...SOP throughout the war was that a general (usually the losing one) would ask for an armistice to recover the wounded. Almost without exception quickly permitted. . ...Grant desperately wanted to, and Lee would have consented in a heartbeat. But Grant would be admitting that he was the loser... Full accounts of the defeat at Cold Harbor were slow to make it to most politicos and the Northern electorate. . ...His duty forced Grant to not make the request. Another time, another place, Lee would have stepped forward... but if *he* requested an armistice, a tactical victory would be reduced to a political defeat. The election might hang on who caved in first. . ...After a couple of days it was Grant. A lot of wounded men died in the field who might have been saved. But it was not sadism or lack of concern... Men had been wounded and killed on both sides for years to achieve victory... and it was at least a possibility that these men might make the difference. . ...Had Sherman not taken Atlanta Lincoln might have lost to McClellan (he was expecting to lose until the news from Atlanta came in). McClellan could not have continued the war. . ...But once Lincoln was re-elected (with the majority of votes from the Army as well) Davis should have gone for the best terms (some were still available in early 1865) he could get. A lot of good men would have survived the war, and less of the South would have been in ashes. . -YP- . -YP-
YankeePapa MarkM32 The north already had it's "Pickett's Charge" at Fredericksburg and even with the appalling losses there and at Chancellorsville, the CSA Army was never able to cut off and destroy the Army of the Potomac on its own land so I doubt they could have done so in the yankee's back yard. Even had Lee won Gettysburg,by finding good ground and mauling a Union attack,he likely would not have been able to destroy it on Union ground where it could reconstitute itself from reserves across the north, all the time, exposing the ANV to the risk of being cut off from Virginia. Some historians like to float the idea that had Lee won Gettysburg and captured Philadelphia or Harrisburg or Baltimore or Washington (highly unlikely due to the strong defenses surrounding the capitol) Lincoln would have been forced to sue for peace. Such ideas show how Lee's thinking was so tied to that of his idol Napoleon,that he couldn't see that war had evolved beyond such limited goals as capturing capitols to the need crush the fighting spirit of the enemy population. I don't buy it. Lincoln would have been just as resolute after losing Philadelphia as Davis was when he lost Richmond. Keep in mind that Grant would still have taken Vicksburg and even if that city held out a little longer and Lincoln recalled Grant to take command of the Army of the Potomac,Sherman would still have likely remained in command to take that Mississippi town. Even the hope by Lee that a Confederate victory in Pennsylvania would force Grant to bring his Army north to drive Lee out of the state,is somewhat wishful thinking,because Vicksburg was so important,Lincoln would never call off the dogs besieging it when he had so many other Federal troops elsewhere he could tap into to reenforce Meade. An example would be the South Carolina campaign to take Charleston, and the Confederate forts protecting it depicted in the film GLORY. Thousands of Federal troops were fighting there in a battle that was more symbolic then strategically necessary and they could have been recalled to Pennsylvania faster then Grant's army due to US Navy transport without hurting the overall war effort. That means the Army of the Potomac would rebuild itself in a matter of weeks while Lee would be trapped in a northern city with no lines of resupply or escape and no way to make up his losses. Instead of a masterstroke that wins the war,Lee could have created his own Yorktown with the Union Army at his front and the US Navy at his back. No,the best shot to win the war was the 1864 strategy of making the Union pay for every foot of ground in blood while offering to talk peace or waiting for Lincoln to be cast out at the polls.
Just a side thought what will happen to me if i put out a video showing me burning the dog piss out of 100 rainbow colored flags? Or doing a moonwalk on rainbow flags? Yea its just a flag!
Waterborne, clluelo. Just to highlight what waterborne said the southern all American badasses are being painted with a broad brush. A untruth that sickens me deeply. Especially when states like Florida and texas send more sons and daughters than any other state to fight for the whole countries ideas. I feel like something or someone is trying to step on our neck. They say its JUST a flag. If its JUST a flag then why try so god damn hard to remove it? You give someone a inch they take a mile. Thats true with family friends or the government. They can can pervert the battle flag all they want. To me its heritage not hate!