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Home » Black Ops & Intel » Empty Chessboards

Empty Chessboards

by Coriolanus · January 25, 2013 · Posted In: Black Ops & Intel
chess-wallpaper-sofrep
This shit is chess. It ain’t checkers. – Alonzo Harris, Training Day

Related Posts
  • The Fusion Analyst: An Intro to All Source Intelligence and Analysis
  • Introducing New SOFREP Writer, Coriolanus
  • Bureaucracy in The Spy Ranks

Bottom Line Up Front: This is a rebuttal to “Fixing Intel: A Blueprint for Making Intelligence Relevant in Afghanistan”(Flynn 2010), and includes my own assertions regarding military intelligence. This post is a series of observations based on my own experience within the community (spanning more than a decade) and a response to navel gazers within the community that have determined that specific emphasis on intelligence du jour will solve our nation’s problems.

I do not yet have a comprehensive solution. I am still working on it, however, even correcting symptomatic issues will seem unpalatable to most policy makers. Having said that, my job has never been one of pleasing decision makers, but rather, tactfully spoon-feeding unpalatable information to colicky adults. I harbor no resentment toward this because I’d like to think it has worked out well to this point in time. This one might be long folks, so I hope you have some coffee. Also…from here on out, fuck tact.

The Value of a Distributed Network of Small Analytic Cells

JICs (Joint Intelligence Centers) suck. Battlefield Surveillance Brigades suck. Stability Information Operations Center (Flynn 2010, 5) suck.

Martius

 

Military intelligence is a horrible hydra or chimera. Pick your beast. It seeks to stay beholden to the TO&E of traditional (and sometimes non-traditional) Army infrastructure. Little intelligence shops to big intelligence shops. TATs (Tactical Analysis Teams) to ridiculously over-staffed JIOC (Joint Intelligence and Operations Centers) or JICs. Policy and decision maker input or interface is at the JIC level.

Forget battlefield rotation. That’s like suggesting a night in the back of your Chevy with Suzie Rottencrotch is like the enduring relationship with your wife. Not the same at all. If someone were to suggest (outside of operational battlefield rotations, and even that’s questionable) that a battlefield rotation by the SecDef to each JIOC or JIC or S2 shop on the battlefield gave them a “real” understanding of what was going on I’d snort Rice Krispy’s through my nose in between chuckles of jaded laughter. What works? Starfish.

A sea of starfish actually. An effective analytic cell that is composed of no less than five analysts and no more than twelve. In the cell, no SIO (senior intelligence officers) or SME (subject matter experts) are required. In fact, there should be none in the form of policy. Instead, a team lead for a particular problem set is chosen. This team lead will drive the problem from inception to conclusion. Team leads may have multiple problem sets. Team leads will also be analysts in other problem sets.

Analyst selection is extremely important. Selection in this case is similar to a type of Special Forces selection. A brief outline of analyst selection might be based on Malcolm Gladwell’s “Outliers” (Gladwell 2008, 69-72). Analysts should be sought on the basis of divergence, not convergence. Questions as part of this process might be: “Why is a manhole cover round?” “If I give you a brick and a blanket, what are all things you could do with it?” Our recruiters need to be looking for Liam Hudson (Gladwell 2008, 70), not John Rambo or a would-be David Petraeus. Oh yeah…young analysts are retarded…old analysts are like the old Biff (Hello McFly!) in Back to the Future 2…annoying. You need maturity, but you don’t need gerontologists.

The kind of people you want as analysts do not generally abide by the rules or do not necessarily work well in groups. They may be introverts. They may be hippies. The analysts may or may not have had a military background. They may or may not have a criminal record. If you are lucky, the analysts have spent a quarter of their lives in some third world war zone as part of their maturation process.

Recruiters should also look for hybrid analysts. “I like to do intelligence analysis AND graphic design.” “I like to do intelligence analysis AND code in Python.” “I like to do intelligence analysis AND I like to shoot and collect weapons from around the world.” “I like to do intelligence analysis AND spend ALL of my off time penetration testing.”

I know a good analyst five to ten minutes after talking to any random person. I gravitate toward them. From my own experience you’ll be lucky if you get a good one. Very lucky. Try getting one out of my kung-fu grip. You need many of these cells augmented by a long tail of software and…

Value Added Small Analytic Cells: Coders

You need coders. Computer scientists. NOT IT dudes. Those are J6 guys. (Love the help desk dudes! (Had to say that to keep my shiznit running.) Uber-nerds supporting nerds. Guys and gals who prefer hexadecimal and binary Looking for Codersover the spoken word.

They are part of the cell of the analysts. Two to four coders per analytic cell. They bring the necessary computational expertise to the cell. They can code pre-processors. They can code scripts and API’s to force open source software to work with each other. They can disassemble a CPU at the logical and physical level. In addition to their expertise in this area, their insights into analysis from a computational standpoint have greatly benefited work in the past.

In particular, from a workflow management perspective; because coders… Uhh… are inherently lazy. Smart…but lazy. Put another way, any coder worth a damn will find the simplest and potentially most elegant way to write a code block because it will save time in the end.

Fourteen-Armed Starfish

in-spire

To finalize this, you now have a fourteen-armed starfish. You need hundreds of these. Maybe thousands. Some of these starfish are working in groups. Some are working individually to support a specific unit. No JIC’s. If you get a VIP or DV in, you corral the cells into a briefing area and have them brief their stuff. The key to this is the “long tail” (Anderson 2006). You need industrial strength software. You need Pacific Northwest National Labs IN-SPIRE, FuturePoint’s Starlight, Semantica Pro, Palantir, Rapid Miner, Tableau, and Google Refine.

Some of these are actually free. IN-SPIRE is generally free to government customers. Rapid Miner is free. Google Refine is free. In fact, you can make the entire tail (if needed)…free. Gephi and or NodeXL are free social network analysis programs. Ontotext is an awesome semantic relationship engine.

Why spend thousands of dollars on Palantir when Gephi will do? I have no idea. The key is to let your analysts and coders decide. You have to trust and respect them to make the best decisions (in this aspect) for you. A good analyst will not seek every program under the sun to do the work you need done. They will seek the cost/benefit, maximizing utility and minimizing cost. That’s their part of their job anyway.

Sooo…Empty Chessboards

“Fixing” implies that something is broken. There is no fixing intel. Our intelligence community is focused almost exclusively on terrorism. Fail. To paraphrase Kanye West, imma let you finish an all…but empty chessboards is what needs to happen. We need to push the pieces off and start with a fresh game constructed around a 2013 reality. Not 1945 reality.

John Robb is probably the most prescient voice in our community. I can’t recommend his blog or book enough. Right now…Charlie or Tango is envisioning a UAV bot-net that supplies on-demand DDOS of a specific topographic area. It’s fucking cheap, and its real.

On the other end of the spectrum, in an interesting bit of irony, the PRC is attacking the US using US economics. Supply and demand is the weapon. This can be done if you have a command economy to fight a free market, particularly if you mobilize an entire nation toward the effort of attaining R&D at any cost. The PRC is undermining us at the one thing the US better than anyone else in: Joint operations. Kill joint C4, and you kill the your enemy’s greatest strength. How do you kill it? Steal the secrets to command and control. Networks. Military networks.

Chinese geeks

That war is being waged right now in a virtual environment and starts with a “sync ack” packet. Companies don’t want to tell the public this. The government doesn’t want to tell the public this. Remember that your economy is based on “fiat” or, loosely paraphrased, “a proposition.” The stability of our economy and government give value to our markets. If you are losing 40% of your R&D investment to another nation-state due to larceny, I’d say you need to start worrying. They like to refer to this entire process as the “Shashou Jian” strategy. Oh yeah…that’s right..they are telling you how they plan on ripping you off. All the way back in 1991.

Succinctly put, we have a national system to manage, identify, and reciprocate against violent extremist organizations and terrorism. Your chance of dying by a terrorist related event is less than being attacked by a shark. Yet there is a 50% chance that a 9/11 style event will occur again within the decade.

Given those figures you might assume our community is looking ahead. You would assume incorrectly. The intelligence community is not looking at the analytic future anymore. We are looking at the past and the present. Afghanistan and maybe some Africa. So much for a strategic pivot.

More importantly, every day more human behavior is added under the auspices of national security and intelligence. Anthropology, nuclear science, epidemiology, machining, engineering, computer science, etc…etc. Note, I said ‘human behavior.’ Intelligence isn’t and shouldn’t be “human intent guessers.”

Action & Effects

That said…there is nothing that humans do, that is not their behavior. War? Human behavior. Drugs? Human behavior. Theft? Human behavior. Etc..etc..

From a positivist standpoint, observable and repeatable matters. As an analyst, I got news for you. I can’t process that aforementioned cognitive load. I need computers like bats need echolocation. I need Linux and Windows boxes and about fifteen computer screens. I also need decision makers to make some decisions.

Actions officers…take some action.

I’m an analyst…I will give you COA’s (courses of action). You gotta trust me to die/sleep at my desk/spend days without sleep/shit in a desk drawer/do anything to get you the best possible picture of your battlefield (which is the globe BTW), but for goodness sake…

Make. A. Decision.

Even if its not a COA. General officers…make strategy. Not “Operation Ivegotabigwang.” That’s not strategy. “Strategery” usually looks something like a joint campaign plan…only better. Do like the Chinese, and copy theirs! Rumor has it operational art is dead and so is strategy. Bad time time to die. We need it. Badly. Check out how the combined chiefs of staff used to manage their commanders. One page. Yet they had a strategy.

Deep Blue versus Garry Kasparov

From a fresh board, start with your knight…not your pawn. This means understanding the laws of thermodynamics and closed systems. Based on the second law of thermodynamics, closed systems will increase to maximal entropy.

Assessment Level

 

 

In data and computational theory, entropy is defined as “a measure of the loss of information in a transmitted signal or message.” (Lexico Publishing, LLC, 2013) Our system of classification as overseen by CAPCO (Controlled Access Program Coordination Office) does not function effectively and is outdated. It is a closed system.

Today’s analyst is confined in a T-SCIF (Tactical-Secure Compartmented Information Facility) or SCIF. Information is fed to the analyst over government circuits. The circuits are classified. The analyst will occasionally have an unclassified circuit controlled by the USG.

Fail.

Use the starfish network. Start with a misattribution system, force analysts to start on the unrestricted internet, and then move up the chain of circuits from SECRET to TOP SECRET. Use sites like Data.gov, media, social media, open source data repositories. These are your first weapons of choice.

Then, when you run out of valid data…hack. Hack, hack, hack, hack, hax0r, hax0ring. Just do it. Do it now. Back Orifice, E-Bomb, DDoS, bot-nets, malwarez, warez, keygens, brute force, overclock CPU’s and shutdown the fan via killer poke.

If you can’t get it, shut it down.

Use the internet to scrape all your open source data and consider hax0ring as NTM (national technical means). Then when the scrape cycle has completed once, push it up. Push it up the classification ladder and cross-cue the data using the aforementioned tools with national technical means.

Think of the internet as the ocean, then the next level as your first catch, and then the last level the best of the catch. Then push it down. Take that and refine the scrape cycle. Use analytic methodologies.

Afterthoughts

Tard Cat

Consider eliminating the classification system and using obfuscation on the low side. Create 50 different variations of the same message broadcast and then re-broadcast. Tell your receiver the correct variant. 20 ICBMs? Or five?

How can your enemy tell the difference? Which message is “real”? Use the media to hype up different variations of the right message. Yes, I mean actual traffic derived from different sources. Tell the NYT we have 20. Tell the Post we have eight. If you have 52 cards and all of them are aces with each containing a minor change, which ace is the true ace? How long would it take you to tell?

As it stands it may not be any different from the leak-ridden culture of one million cleared personnel you have now. Use the massive information barrage to your advantage and beat your enemy’s OODA loop. Open source warfare is not for the timid, and its encroaching on an entropic system that is archaic. Information always seeks to be free. More rebuttal to come?

End of Line.

Bibliography

  • Anderson, Chris. 2006. The Long Tail?: Why the future of Business is Selling Less of More. New York: Hyperion.
  • Flynn, Michael T. 2010. Fixing Intel: A Blueprint for Making Intelligence Relevant in Afghanistan. Voices From the Field. Center for a New American Security.
  • Gladwell, Malcolm. 2008. Outliers: The Story of Success. New York: Little, Brown and Co.
  • Lexico Publishing, LLC. 2013. “Entropy.” Dictionary.com. Accessed January 22.
  • Zhongwen, Huo, and Wang Zongxiao. “Sources and Techniques of Obtaining National Defense Science and Technology Intelligence.” Kexue Jishu Wenxuan Publishing Co, 1991.

Some images courtesy of

  • Joint Warfighting Center, and Joint Concept Development and Experimentation Directorate. 2006. Commander’s Handbook for an Effects-Based Approach to Joint Operations. Handbook. Suffolk, Virginia: Joint Forces Command.

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About The Author

Coriolanus

Coriolanus's background is as an all source fusion intelligence analyst. He currently works as a hybrid intelligence analyst and data scientist (similar to ORSA). He has worked in the intel industry for over ten years and specializes in DoD joint intelligence analysis, counter terrorism, joint targeting, and cyber information operations, among others. Coriolanus has worked at the tactical, operational, and strategic levels of war working for special mission units and policy makers; and working in areas such as Central and South America, Iraq and Afghanistan theaters of war, and ithroughout southeast Asia. He retains a B.A. In International Relations from a US university and is finishing a grad degree in his field with a focus on counter terrorism, and speaks a second language fluently. Due to his placement and access, clearance , and desire for privacy, Coriolanus is a pseudonym for a FNULNU citizen who bleeds red, white, and blue. More importantly the views he elaborates on should not be construed to represent the views of the govenment of the United States of America, it's representatives, or his employer. They are his and his alone. Welcome to spook country.

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johngreenwood1982
johngreenwood1982 5pts

Over haul. From the ground up with emphasis added to joint operations. Superficial restructuring adds little in the end.  There are many flaws just in intel.I would suggest a longer basic training for all troops and make sure that training to standard dictates the score. Individual units should be tested and scored yearly from outside graders from within the sphere of JSOC. Training over seas should be done regularly by everyone.  FOB should take on the look of fire-bases and become more layered in defences. OER's and NCOER's should be more based on the performance of subordinates. not on individual actions and 3rd party reports. Thus the Officer or NCO should have their troops tested on a basic, moderate and advanced level of knowledge relative to their position. Their performance should dictate their majority score. That means lots of tests and by necessity lot of training. Decrease the gap of the regular army and rangers. This is not to say we are trying to make an army of elite infantry. Just close the gap.Which the additional training would help with. Do away with the so called "warrior leader course" in the Army and bring back actual real life mentoring. Tests to see if a SPC is ready for leadership could be done after several dedicated mentors have had a chance to handle the young troop and give them control of small duties. I don't think this the end all be all list here. But I do think this is a step in the right direction.

RedWanderer
RedWanderer 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

Wish lfyre had an edit function.  I can't type slowly for the life of me.  Punching out and heading to dreamland.  G'nite you guys.  Btw, hj, I can tell you read a lot of good stuff.  I think you've already effectively leap-frogged. :)

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @RedWanderer  Thanks RW... have a good night. :)

LauraKinCA
LauraKinCA 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @hjw1dr  @dmalert 

You two calling it a night too??

 

  @RedWanderer

 

LauraKinCA
LauraKinCA 5pts

 @dmalert  @hjw1dr  @RedWanderer

 This is the one.. http://sofrep.com/15851/no-shit-there-i-was-mayan-end-of-the-world/

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts

 @dmalert  @LauraKinCA  @RedWanderer  I'll fill yu in over at the Other thread. :) 

dmalert
dmalert 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @LauraKinCA  @hjw1dr  @RedWanderer sure

dmalert
dmalert 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @hjw1dr  @LauraKinCA  @RedWanderer Sick today?  Feel better

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @dmalert  @LauraKinCA  @RedWanderer  I'm still reading your post, DM... Novel! yes. :)

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @dmalert  @LauraKinCA  @RedWanderer  I will hangs for a little.. then turn in too. Feeling better.. but need to stop the crud. :)

LauraKinCA
LauraKinCA 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @dmalert  @hjw1dr  @RedWanderer

 Shall we adjourn to the no shit thread from 1/5??

dmalert
dmalert 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @LauraKinCA  @hjw1dr  @RedWanderer Up a little bit longer - have an early morning.

LauraKinCA
LauraKinCA 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @dmalert  @hjw1dr  @RedWanderer

 Well, now I have to go read it before we mosey anywhere else to chat :)

dmalert
dmalert 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @LauraKinCA  @hjw1dr  @RedWanderer Sorry was writing a novel.  LOL

RedWanderer
RedWanderer 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

Dm, you and I are about 95% on the same page.  Probably the biggest thing I disagree with you about is banking regulation.  It's going to take a lot of energy to explain it at length but the banking regulations from the 30s you mentioned several times was a stop gap measure thrown in by FDR (Glass Steagal) to stop hemmoraghing.  It wasn't thought out for the long term, and in the long term it really dampened competition.  Financial centers around the world were starting to out compete us because of it.  They were integrating banking, insurance, and investment, bringing economies of scale to THEIR banking industry and smoothing out the downturns in business cycles.

 

Anyway, long story short, Congress passed bipartisan legislation in the 90s to fix that.  It was called  Graham Rudman and it passed with overwhelming support by both parties.  And this is the point that's lost by conspiracy theorists, Libertarians, and folks who have an extremely cynical view of all politicians, but passing G-Rudman put New York back in the most competitive position visa vis all foreignors.   Having the best financial system is key to having the best economy. 

 

And the thing that Occupy Wall Street and others get wrong the most about G-Rudman is that is did not remove all regulation.  Let me repeat:  it did not remove all regulations as OWS and Libertarians assert.  Which they now use to argue for going back to 1930s regulation or Glass Steagall.

 

All it did was remove OPERATIONAL firewalls for banking, insurance, and investment houses.  It did NOT remove the REGULATIONS for banking, insurance, investment.   In othe words G-Steagal said you couldn't have all those functions under one roof.  G Rudman said you could - just like foreignors were alread doing which was making them more competitive, and sucking investment away from us.

 

The regulations never went anywhere -- there are still the same bureaucrats whose job it is to regulate banking, others do insurance, and others due investments.  It's just that now they can all be done under one roof.

 

There is nothing I see Occupy Wall Street misrepresent more than this issue. 

 

I could go on and on about regulation....and how most people just don't understand it...and think we need more.  But Frank Dodd only served to stifle the hell out of loan making, hitting the little guys the most.  And contributing to our shitty economic situation.

 

dmalert
dmalert 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @RedWanderer I understand the regs quite well, but let me first say OWS are a bunch of middle class lay-abouts tweeting all day long on the latest i-Douche paid for mommy and daddy that wouldn't understand finance, business or life if it snuck up on them and bit them on the bottom.

 

The function of a commercial bank is to take deposits and make loans - the credit they provide is the lifeblood of SMB and one key to financing the operations of large corporates - mortgages as well.  And if they fail you lose your deposits and so does the corporation and because they can trade swaps/derivatives and invest in other securities is a big reason why there was a liquidity crunch with TARP.  They just kept borrowing money for nothing at the discount window and invested it into securities instead of lending - this hampered recovery.

 

And our banks, insurance companies and investment banks were plenty competitive.  You will note at Basel II (one thing we got right) European banks were allowed to carry sovereign debt listed at zero risk - that worked out real well and the result is most European banks, especially the German ones, are technically insolvent.

 

So I stand firm on Glass-Steagall.  TARP bailed them out this time, but if JP Morgan and B of A were to fail do you think we can still print enough to make everyone whole.  You are making the argument that Weill did, which he has since ironically recanted.  As for derivatives - get rid of them.  Wait and see when the market moves violently these toxic pieces of shit are going to take down the global banking system.  Don't blame me if your ATM card doesn't work in 2 years.

 

And there is so much more than this.  I'm not anti-finance or business rather a voice of balance.

RedWanderer
RedWanderer 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

I agree with the majority of what you guys have said but I do have some disagreements.  Let me think about how to summarize them. 

RedWanderer
RedWanderer 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

There's so much here I don't know where to start.  LOL.  I think we should just let Atrium and dmalert teach finance class. :)  Hj can chip in.

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @RedWanderer  I'm not chipping in much... and would rather read the musings anyway. Learning new stuff !

LauraKinCA
LauraKinCA 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @hjw1dr  @RedWanderer

 Me too re reading it all and absorbing.

LauraKinCA
LauraKinCA 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @hjw1dr

 Polo.... your turn!

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

Macro... not Marco (though that's a perfectly fine name)  lol

LauraKinCA
LauraKinCA 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @hjw1dr  @RedWanderer

 OK, I will have to check it out.

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @LauraKinCA  @RedWanderer  Laura, the 3 part video on "The Commanding Heights" -- like 6 hours long. is worth it. I saw it a long time ago so fast forwarded what I remembered, but was fascinated by the marco stuff.

dmalert
dmalert 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @RedWanderer LOL - Not an economist just opining.

Farlet10
Farlet10 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 4 Like

It appears the dialogue has developed far beyond the original topic, but I felt this SWJ piece is still quite relevant. http://smallwarsjournal.com/jrnl/art/you-can%E2%80%99t-play-chess-when-the-taliban-is-playing-poker

dmalert
dmalert 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @Farlet10 Thanks for posting - very good and well written read.  I have read a lot of other really well thought out pieces on other, but related topics.  And where I struggle is we have so many sharp people so in the know - I just don't understand why such people are not running things.

LauraKinCA
LauraKinCA 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @dmalert  @Farlet10

 Many don't or can't play the games to get to the positions of running things. Not because they aren't bright enough, but don't have the temperment for it.

RedWanderer
RedWanderer 5pts

@Farlet10 In other words, it was confirmed this week we have a CONTRACTING economy despite the trillions of dollars thrown at the economy to stimulate it. I don't just mean a SLOWER GROWING economy, I mean actually CONTRACTING, which none of the governement systems anticipated. And that should scare the shit out of everyone. We are also beginning to see what I believe is a string of offensive actions by AQ or even loosely affiliated AQ groups that is affecting Americans and American Embassies directly, which have also not been properly anticipated by "government decision making systems." Or if the systems have been predicting really well but current Administration folks are ignoring, then folks should be blowing a whistle. I personally believe it's the limitation of the sytems from having worked in so many sytems integration companies and knowing their limitations.

RedWanderer
RedWanderer 5pts

@Farlet10 We probably have taken a bit far however with the greatest respect I would say your comments reflect the very stovepiped thinking a lot of us are worried about. Which is reflected in the very poor job our government is doing in ancticipating the problems in foreign policy/Middle east/Africa and in the US and global economy - which are all interconnected.

Farlet10
Farlet10 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 4 Like

 @RedWanderer  @Farlet10 I understand completely. I intended to say, the dialogue has developed far beyond my understanding of the original topic. I am still developing my understanding of international policy, and have only a basic grasp of the topics.

theAtrium (banned)
theAtrium (banned) 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XD_4eipD-ZM (you'll need boxes of Orange Sticks to get through these documentaries)

 

http://www.sweetcandy.com/candies/sticks/orange-sticks/orange-sticks-dark-chocolate-10-5-oz-box.html

Soft, fresh orange jelly centers blanketed in rich dark chocolate, Sweet Candy Company's classic Chocolate Covered Orange Sticks are the perfect candy to eat yourself or gift to a friend. Naturally flavored. Made in the USA. Kosher Dairy.

theAtrium (banned)
theAtrium (banned) 5pts

* add Irony too...

 

theAtrium (banned)
theAtrium (banned) 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 Monopoly and unintended consequences:

 

" When the Supreme Court broke up the Standard Oil Trust in 1911, electric lights were rapidly replacing kerosene lamps. But the gasoline-driven automobile was just beginning to appear. Gasoline, up to that time a useless byproduct of oil refining, made the companies formed from the trust wealthier than they had ever been. Rockefeller, owning a 25 percent share in each of the new companies, was worth $900 million in 1913 ($13 billion in today's dollars). This made him the richest man in the world."

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keRTBBY0VIc (The Men Who Built America, you gotta watch this along w/ "Commanding Heights", @hjw1dr )

theAtrium (banned)
theAtrium (banned) 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @RedWanderer  @TheAtrium  @Farlet10

 

I think that was my unintended point, RW. These fuckin' analogies/metaphors are confusing, hell even the Chinese are confused. Let's just stick to Monopoly, makes everything easier.

RedWanderer
RedWanderer 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

@TheAtrium @Farlet10 LOL, A...I think I like what you were saying but did you mean WE are playing checkers and they are playing chess? And the Chinese play "go?"

RedWanderer
RedWanderer 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

@Farlet10 Oh, roger, Farlet. Sorry I misunderstood! Well stick around SOFREP as it appears we are collectively cutting through the entire US govt aparatus, LOL.

theAtrium (banned)
theAtrium (banned) 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

 @Farlet10  @RedWanderer

 

Thanks, Matt! Reminded me of this article: http://sofrep.com/9885/chinese-taliban-partnership/

 

They're playing checkers, while we're playing chess, while the Chinese are playing go (wei'chi), but when you ask the Chinese, they'll say, we're playing Chinese checkers, no one plays fuckin' go in China.

 

 

dmalert
dmalert 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

Atrium I'd also say one needs to look at financial threats and I think Coriolanus touched on this last night.  And there are so many things here, but it's an area where algorithms are very important and I don't mean a threat whereby a market may collapse, but where a state actor is trying to play hell with it for any # of reasons.

theAtrium (banned)
theAtrium (banned) 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

 @dmalert  Good point. @hjw1dr once posted a story of a dairy farmer suspected of money laundering. Stuff like that needs to be made public. On market sabotage via technology or actual transaction, I think most of what's in the news are Chinese hackers. Very interesting subject.

 

 

 

 

dmalert
dmalert 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @TheAtrium  @hjw1dr Had a long chat with an individual about it say 2 years ago.  Was PRC fall 08.  Any math needs to be married with keen market understanding.  Not hacking, but taking positions to deliberate push market down through resistance levels to trigger sell off.

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @dmalert  @TheAtrium  And now I'm listening to a documentary on Black money.  

oh, the joys of being stuck at home! LOL

dmalert
dmalert 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @TheAtrium  @hjw1dr Sorry didn't say that the right way. 

 

Holy shit let's not get started on the whole food topic - the thread will end up with 20k comments. 

 

Laundry business  - The problem is so much negative comes with many illicit businesses.  With Mexico money is made with drugs and then gets reinvested into other negatives like guns and human trafficking. And this has a terrible impact on society.  Heroin, meth and other stuff destroys many young and other lives.

 

In the case of Miami so much illicit money came into the city that a lot got funneled into legit businesses and a lot of law abiding people were earning their livings off of it.  So you can argue that it built modern Miami and it did, but this came at a very high price.  So I would agree that it's extremely negative.

 

It destroys morality as well.

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts

 @dmalert  @TheAtrium  where the money in those "food corporations" comes or goes is another question.... but yes. Good points all.

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @TheAtrium  @dmalert 

Soon as I saw the title on the one vid, I thought this was what you were going to post:   :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0MzfDcAUkb8

theAtrium (banned)
theAtrium (banned) 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @hjw1dr  @dmalert  " so it seems in their eye that corporations are taking over the food market. "

 

There's been quite a few documentaries on this.

 

But on the flipside, and this is for "Breaking Bad" fans, there have also been quite a lot of Mexicans taking over agricultural type small businesses (they've worked in the industry, so either open their own small business or take over from their former employers).

 

These Mexicans (many naturalized), when faced between Monsanto/Cargill and having to take it up the ass, usually will find a better deal with drug cartels (or subsidiaries), since all they want to do is launder money.

 

The negative impact of having laundered money injected in the economy, I'm sure dm can cover, but here's a couple of videos of cute pigs:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=843yH_0RMIA and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnrJudh0KJg

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @dmalert  @TheAtrium  K- I'm home today ill. But brought home some work.see if I can finish a few things then be back later. 

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

 @dmalert  @TheAtrium  As for Dairy farmer and money laundering-- the farmers I've talked to who are family owned (just a few so take with a large grain of salt) have mentioned that corporations are buying up larger and larger tracts. It's harder to get crop insurance, and any changes in subsidies will hurt the smaller farmer more-- so it seems in their eye that corporations are taking over the food market. 

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @dmalert  @TheAtrium  Oh, I'm probably not the right person to be talking about this with anyway! Not my expertise... but thought I'd just throw in since you guys were referencing me :)

dmalert
dmalert 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @hjw1dr  @TheAtrium Unclear and not something that I look at.  Again the PRC was caught doing stuff.  This said given what transpired extreme volatility is not a surprise and even if foreigners were meddling he got here by our own doing.

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts like.author.displayName 1 Like

 @dmalert  @TheAtriumhttp://3.bp.blogspot.com/_d4aL5xTH0xg/SSar1y0PeMI/AAAAAAAADHU/NqdK-Tv5P7M/s1600-h/market+corrections.PNG

charts of historic corrections.  As of Nov 2008

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @dmalert  @TheAtrium  Still wouldn't be hard to cause a stampede

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @dmalert  @TheAtrium  Yeah, my thoughts too. But the rumors were flying at the time. Some thought it was extra 000s being added via hacking...  :)

dmalert
dmalert 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @hjw1dr  @TheAtrium Disagree on AQ.  They don't have the cash.  You need billions and billions of dollars.  The Fed put a lot of money out there at the discount window.  Given a crazy market unwinding volatility isn't a surprise.

hjw1dr
hjw1dr 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @TheAtrium  @dmalert  I remember hearing in some circles a general concern that the greater volatility in markets in 2008-2009 was due to interference from other sources - excess of monetary fluidity. There was a interesting trend in market and profit taking that seemed to point to greater than normal volatility (I'm not trader or market person- so if you've already dismissed- just ignore.)

I just remember this: A lot fo suspicion thrown at foreign interference or AQ. 

Apparently the markets would stabilize then have a sudden sell off with seemlingly little to no psychological or external markers (was early Nov 2008- to Dec 2009) I think. In the herd mentality, with fluidity problems I don't think it would take much to cause a stampede. (Hence shutting down the markets--)

 

I see the links to "Commanding Heights" watched it a while ago. Will have to view it again to catch up. Thanks for the links. 

dmalert
dmalert 5pts

 @TheAtrium  I'm game.

theAtrium (banned)
theAtrium (banned) 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 2 Like

 @dmalert  @hjw1dr 

 

" to deliberate push market down through resistance levels to trigger sell off. "

 

Supposedly the KGB tried this in the mid to late 1980s, they didn't trigger anything, just a whole lot of money lost for nothing.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C67PNebjsdY

dmalert
dmalert 5pts like.author.displayName like.author.displayName like.author.displayName 3 Like

 @TheAtrium  And this was private sector individual not IC

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